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Gary Martin JH 15371 Member
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I'm sure there are many people restoring cars that can associate to this story. JH 15371 suffered an engine fire back in 1986, and my dad and I bought it at a salvage sale shortly after this. The car was in fairly nice shape from the doors back with 55 K miles on the clock. It sat until 2004 when I started restoring the engine and engine bay. I had it together and started it up last summer. It could have been driven at that point, mechanically it was done, but the fenders needed paint and a new hood and windshild installed. The car had a little rust, floor boards, trunk floor, where fenders meet the rocker, etc. Not bad, no holes. I decided to fix the rust and repaint the entire car. The yellow paint was a bit dingy on the back anyway. Paint was stripped and rust treated with POR. This is as far as I got last winter before it got too cold in the garage to work on it. So it sat. This spring I contacted an aquaintance of mine with a restoration shop, thinking I might have him prime and paint the car. He came over to look at it, and he then started telling me how my rust preparation was not good enough, and that to do it right the car needed complete dissassemble, rust blasted off, body panels fitted, body work finished, primed, painted, etc. He offered to let me do a lot of the grunt work to cut costs. But even with this he said we were talking something like $8 to $10,000 to paint the car, and it could even be more! I already have about $5,000 in restoring the mechanicals and buying parts such as the windshield and hood. For some reason I took this guys advice and completly dissasembled the car this spring. Now the car is all apart and I'm looking at a hefty price to finish it. Yes, it would be a very nice car when done, probably nicer than needed. But I could buy a nice running JH for a lot less than what it would cost to put mine togetter! I'm a bit disscouraged at this point. I was not planning to have $15 or $20K in this car. I have other things such as my house that need work too. I need advice, specifically on how to finish the body and paint for less that $10,000 if possible. I don't want it to become one of those cars that sits in pieces for years. Motivate me, give me a pep talk. Talk me into keeping my project on track. Thanks, Gary |
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Art DeKneef Member
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What's that saying.... It's always darkest before the light. I been in your position a few times restoring cars. Yes, paint jobs can cost that much. There is a lot of labor involved if you want a good job done. You can save a lot by doing most of the work yourself, if you can find a painter to work with. Most painters will not paint a car they haven't prepped. If something goes wrong, each blames the other. Not a position I would put someone I considered a friend. You mention 'Paint was stripped and rust treated with POR. This is as far as I got last winter before it got too cold in the garage to work on it. So it sat.' Was paint stripped and left exposed or was paint stripped near rust areas and POR applied to all bare metal? Any bare metal left exposed probably had surface rust that needed removing. If you intended to paint over the POR, that's a bad decision in my opinion. The specs say you can paint over POR, but none of the major paint manufactures recommend you do that or will warranty the paint. You need to pick a paint line and color and follow their recommendations. POR is OK, but I like and use a product called PickleX-20. Similiar but better. See the thread 'Rust Repair' near the bottom. Having the car in pieces makes it easy to clean and prep the panels. That is how I am doing one of the 74s right now. I'm removing four to six layers of paint. That's original primer, original color, primer, different color, some spots have more primer and color. That's too many layers to paint over. Besides, I'm modifying the car some so I have some bodywork going on also. I sanded as much off as I could with everything still together. As a piece like a fender came off, I cleaned it up, removed all the paint, and then coated with the PickleX-20. As long as it doesn't get wet, the fender is protected from rust. I can put the fender on the car and do bodywork as needed. If I feel it needs another coat where I worked leaving bare metal, spray, wipe off, and leave dry. When piece is done, if I want to I can epoxy prime it. I do all this in my garage. Painting pieces is relatively easy to do. It's trying to paint the whole car that things get real interesting. Having a good paint job is in the preparation. Having a geat paint job is doing a great job in the preparation. Having the car in pieces is fustrating. Tell me about it. I think the same thing about buying a nice running JH and selling everything else. But I know that soon after that, I would be thinking about fixing it up some. It helps me by working on it a little every week. I'm making progress but work, family, and life get priority. Sometimes my son will come over and help. When the grandson is over sometimes he helps too. He's five years old. The standing joke is that the car might be ready when he learns to drive. What body work needs done? Painting the car can be done with the panels fitted or in pieces. I did a VW that way some time ago. Primed everything and painted all the parts individually with a couple of coats. Let it dry a couple of days and put the parts together. Sanded the car and applied the final two coats. Then did the polishing and buffing. Depends on the paint you choose, single stage or base coat/clear coat. Ask your acquaintance what he uses for paint and any recommendations he might have, if you haven't already. Check around and see if there is another painter that might be willing to help and guide. There's always the Maaco paint job route. Hopefully Mitch will comment on what he did when he painted his JH. Art |
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Judson Manning Member 
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Gary, First of all: No one's opinion counts unless it's your's! There will be 1000 critics telling you what's "wrong" with your car. The only person you have to satisfy is yourself. Come to grips with the fact this is your hobby and not a money making venture. This is YOU doing what YOU love, not one of those shows on the Discovery Channel. For Healey's sake, don't think of it in terms of a 'normal' car. You could easily blow $10k-$15k playing golf, kiaking or surfing, and in the end you'd have great memories but nothing to show for it. Think of it much more like a long-term committed relationship (like marriage, it's got it's ups and downs). In 1992 if you told me I'd STILL be working on 13492, I would have said you were crazy....but guess what, it's been providing me with 14 years of 'entertainment' and solidarity with other JH members which is priceless to me. May I suggest Zoloft or a good stiff drink??? Best Regards |
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Gary Martin JH 15371 Member
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Thanks, Art and Judson. To answer some of Art's questions about what I've done so far. The front fenders, hood, trunk, windshield and doors are off the car. All exterior surfaces have been stripped to bare metal. I repainted engine bay a year ago, this is fine but will likely paint another coat when the car is painted. Floor boards were stripped of paint where surface rust was present, and used the POR procedure here. As the POR was still tacky, I sprayed PPG epoxy primer over the POR. I'm using the PPG line of paint materials. I did the same procedure for the surface rust at fender/rocker panel joints. Here I removed the rivits on rear fenders so I could pull out the bottom part of fender to access the surface rust between fender and rocker. Since I sprayed epoxy primer over the POR, I assumed I could then paint over this later. The rest of the exterior is still bare metal. I had planned to go over all this with 3M Rust Conditioner which I think might be similar to the PickelX before priming. There is not much body work needed. Just a few small dents and a minor crease on left side. The hood will need the most body work. I bought a nice used hood, but when I stripped the paint off I found it was about 60% covered with bondo. The underside shows no signs of major dents so I'm not sure why it has all these thin patches of bondo. I know a bit about painting. I have painted lots of fenders and varoius parts before. I once painted a whole car, it turned out OK, but not really a professional job. I was planing to paint the car in pieces, since it is difficult to spray door jams, trunk lip, etc with the car togheter. I will probably go the base coat/clear coat road. My friend with the restoration shop also paints cars in pieces for the same reasons and he also uses the PPG line of paint. He said he does this all the time and there is no problem matching panels by painting in pieces. His shop does everything from low buck repairs, to high dollar restorations. He has done several show cars that are in magazines. He does not like to set a price for a job as there are usually unexpected costs that can run the bill up. I don't know any other painters in the area that I can work with. At least I have known this guy for 10 years. I think I might do this in stages to help avoid sticker shock. Have my friend strip the rust, fit panels, body work and prime the car. Then stop and see where we are at. If costs have not gone too far out of control, then proceed to paint the car. I do not want to go the Maaco route. They look OK for two years, then the paint goes dull. It seems I'm kind of a prefectionist. I see no reason doing something half ass. You might as well do it right the first time. As for calming the nerves, I do have a keg of Pelican IPA in my garage. A typical evening in the garage will be a two pint affair on the IPA index. Gary |
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Thomas Thomson Member
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Gary : Couple of thoughts - talk to the guy doing the stripping and make sure he doesn't apply any rust preventative. The place that dipped the panels on 13753 did but neglected to mention it and paint won't stick to that stuff worth a hoot. The problem with the hood may be a common one - that is attempting to close the thing without releasing the catch on the hood prop. This will put a kink the panel which is very difficult to repair. (guys named Tom have been known to do this) To do body work and painting on 16971 I built a rotisser--- roter-- rotissy-- you know what I mean. It makes the job ever so much easier and faster. Good luck ! Tom PS Pushing a piece of sandpaper can be a good form of therapy |
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